LockedPuzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work

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AUgrizzrider
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2008/06/19 07:40:15 (permalink)

Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work

Alright - I got the vfj stage 3 clutch work done - very excited about it until last night when i lined up with another brute without any clutch work. Both bikes are set up the same - both are 07 BF 750's, 27" MST's (same air pressure), snorkeled, jetted, and dyna cdi - only difference is i have the clutch work. And i did the work to both of them. so i know they are the same. Both these bikes have run side by side since day one. One has not been any faster than the other except on take off (driver).
I can get the jump on him everytime but I can also get on his bike and get the jump on him while he's riding mine - so its the driver off the bottom. but he catches me in the end while on his or I continue to be out front when I'm on his. If we take off from a rolling start (10 mph) they are nose to nose the entire time. [:@] 
When I put the primary back on - I put on new kawi belt on it as well and checked belt deflection so all that is good. Also VFJ put the maroon primary spring in it for me too.
Anything you guys can help me with will be greatly appreciated. it sucks spending that kind of money and have no to very little difference.... [:(]
Note: I'm not dissing the work that was done at all so please dont take it that way. VFJ is the man and we all know that so dont take it that I'm downing him. I'm just wondering if there is anything else I need to do to get the full potential out of his work.  
post edited by AUgrizzrider - 2008/06/19 07:42:22

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Fredonia Freeks ATV
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-08 Brute-650 with a few...
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#1

33 Replies Related Threads

    sdf1201
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 08:11:06 (permalink)
    Start messing with the clutch springs and weights. His have to be clutched differently than a stocker.

     
    #2
    Guest
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 08:16:27 (permalink)
    The Stage 3 is noted as for big CC's and NOS.  Are you running either of these?  The Stage 3 is cut more of an angle for better belt grip.  If you did not have the bigger CC's or NOS you should have gone with the Stage 2.  Your clutch springs and setup has a lot to do with the speed of the machine.  I know the VFJ clutch is lighter and should help out a little.  I would call John up and let him know what you got.  I am sure he will give you some advise on what springs to run with you tires.

    08 brute 650
    28 swamplites on rattlesnakes
    highliter springs
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    #3
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 08:26:33 (permalink)
    FF1501 - before i did this - i discussed everything with john and he recommended the stage 3. Told him exactly how my bike was set up and how I ride and he still said the stage 3. He said there would be no loss in any area only gains. I'm going to give him a call shortly but wondering what everyone else thought.   

    sdf1201- his clutch is 100% stock - even original belt with 800 miles on it. Everything that has been done to it - I've done it. It stays in my shop too so he hasnt taken it any where else to have anything done.

    Its not a competition between he and I - we just lined up to see what mine would do ---- Results very disappointing. [:(] 
    post edited by AUgrizzrider - 2008/06/19 08:29:19

    -----------------------------
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    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
    04 Foreman 450 with a few...  

    WAR EAGLE!!!!!!

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    #4
    Guest
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 08:49:32 (permalink)
    I am going to do the stage 3 just for the extra belt grip.  That is the biggest thing with the brutes.  Trying to keep them from eating belts.  I know people say that the clutch made the bike faster but the springs are the things to mess with to get one faster on the top end or the bottom end.

    08 brute 650
    28 swamplites on rattlesnakes
    highliter springs
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    dynatek cdi
    almond secondary
    #5
    05CAMO750
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 09:24:26 (permalink)
    I am sure John would have said to do the stage three, he told me stock brutes have the power to benefit from it.  Did you do the spider mod also, how about weights?  Only other thing i can think of is letting it have a little time to break in, from what i have been told, once it has some time to break in, it it performs to its full potential.  I havent riden mine since the clutch went to John, but i did the spider, kebc removal, and the dalton's.  I hope i can tell when i get it back from amr, i know how you feel, that isn't a cheap mod.  for mine john told me to go with comet black primary, and almond secondary, and i also run 27 inch mst's, maybe something to try.[:D]

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    #6
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 09:58:16 (permalink)
    yeah i had the spider mod and kebc removal as well. Didn't do anything with weights because he said stock weights and secondary will be fine.
     
    I just tried to call him but he's out until saturday or monday. They're going to have him call me. The guy I spoke with was puzzled too but he said John should have some more suggestions.

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    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
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    #7
    AV8R
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 10:22:46 (permalink)
    Keep us updated, I'm wanting to do the VFJ mod but I'll wait to see what happens with you. You'd think he'd know by now what springs work best with what mods since he's been doing it so long. 
    #8
    Rinny650
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 10:32:09 (permalink)
    If its the bike in your avatar then are you running the red Secondary? Also if you have a stock primary spring then stick that in and try a run with it in.

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    AV8R
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 10:32:38 (permalink)
    Oh and how much does the mod run if you don't mind me asking..
    #10
    Rinny650
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 10:39:10 (permalink)
    He told me that it would be $185.00 plus the spring from EPI. 

    Team C.I.C.

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    6" Fabtech
    2" Daystar
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    #11
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 11:37:14 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: Rinny650

    If its the bike in your avatar then are you running the red Secondary? Also if you have a stock primary spring then stick that in and try a run with it in.

     
    No its not the bike in my avatar. Thats my old brute. This is an 07 with specs in the original post.

    -----------------------------
    Fredonia Freeks ATV
    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
    04 Foreman 450 with a few...  

    WAR EAGLE!!!!!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/AUCatRider
    #12
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 11:39:26 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: TEXAN AVIATOR

    Oh and how much does the mod run if you don't mind me asking..

     
    Stage 3 work is $295 plus you have to pay the shipping to him then he pays the return shipping. You also have to buy what spring you want - he doesnt carry them. I bought mine from epi (maroon - thats what he said i needed). He will put it in for you if you ship it with the primary.

    -----------------------------
    Fredonia Freeks ATV
    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
    04 Foreman 450 with a few...  

    WAR EAGLE!!!!!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/AUCatRider
    #13
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 11:40:29 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: Rinny650

    If its the bike in your avatar then are you running the red Secondary? Also if you have a stock primary spring then stick that in and try a run with it in.

     
    He didnt return my stock spring when he shipped it back.

    -----------------------------
    Fredonia Freeks ATV
    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
    04 Foreman 450 with a few...  

    WAR EAGLE!!!!!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/AUCatRider
    #14
    ExcessiveForce07
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 13:22:22 (permalink)
    Well... I guess I will be getting some webcams instead![:)]

    2007 Brute Force 650i Silver
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    #15
    BAD BRUTE 650
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 14:03:40 (permalink)
    Install lighter weights and a O/B spring and you will see a difference.
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    SSTOGI
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 15:09:09 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: ExcessiveForce07

    Well... I guess I will be getting some webcams instead![:)]

     
     
    now that's money well spent[;)]

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    #17
    GoatManx
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 18:20:05 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: BAD BRUTE 650

    Install lighter weights and a O/B spring and you will see a difference.


    Agreed... you'll be considerably faster with some v-force weights (54g) in that clutch... This was worth 3 tenths on an asphault track in 330ft.

    Only problem with that is when it comes time to spray the nitrous it will hit the rev limiter. :(

    This is on a built motor haven't tried it on a 08 brute.

    What tires are you guys running?
    post edited by GoatManx - 2008/06/19 18:22:09

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    SSTOGI
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 19:06:49 (permalink)
    I agree with lighter weights.... The spidermod makes the clutch act as if it has heavier weights then it does thus dropping rpms . The lighter weights will give you back the rpms you lost . In other words you gained overdrive but you lost topend rpms making it basically canceling eachother out to some degree.

    BF750 BUILT FOR BUSINESS
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    #19
    elkbow
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 19:49:29 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: FF1501

    The Stage 3 is noted as for big CC's and NOS.  Are you running either of these?  The Stage 3 is cut more of an angle for better belt grip.  If you did not have the bigger CC's or NOS you should have gone with the Stage 2.  Your clutch springs and setup has a lot to do with the speed of the machine.  I know the VFJ clutch is lighter and should help out a little.  I would call John up and let him know what you got.  I am sure he will give you some advise on what springs to run with you tires.

     
    not required, i just have pipe and programmer and mine is a total different beast, i did runs down the street with the stock clutch to check speed and times over 100 yards, then sent the clutch off to have the stage 3, alot quicker and 8 mph faster in that distance....
     
    something else is wrong, check everything over, i'm running the epi maroon also, not to say its the ultimate for your setup though, so if you can't tell the difference right away, something is wrong

    Dave

    '10 Polaris 850 XP EPS
    #20
    dgcat
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 20:12:26 (permalink)
    i have also talked with john,, he said stage 3,  spider mod, maroon spring, etc. and mine is stock with 27,s.  he also said stock weights are the best by far. i have not had mine done yet and probably wont now.  too many ?? on the clutch mod,,,maybe its great for belt grip for muddin. with that setup,, j said i could run 70+ mph in low. ?? maybe. keep us posted. i,m lookin for a setup to improve over stock with my 27 mudlites  and prob wont do any other mods.. stock equals reliable.

    theres another old saying senator,, dont **** down my back and tell me its rainin
    #21
    MN750BRUTE
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/19 22:59:04 (permalink)
    I have the Stage 3 mod. with the EPI maroon spring and couldn't be happier.
    I've raced 6 other BF's and remain undefeated, 2 of them had Dyna's. I pull away from them midrange thru top end. 75MPH so far.
    Mine wasn't very impressive right away either, I also expected instant results. I emailed John and he told me it would take some time for the belt to wear ito the new sheeve angle, he was correct. After about 150-200miles I pulled the belt gaurd to just inspect. There was some belt dust but nothing alarming. I wiped the clutch sheeves with a shop cloth dampened with brake cleaner and scrubed the belt in hot soapy water with a scotch brite pad to deglaze it.
    It's been a beast since than[:D]
     

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    #22
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/20 07:34:08 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: GoatManx

    ORIGINAL: BAD BRUTE 650

    Install lighter weights and a O/B spring and you will see a difference.


    Agreed... you'll be considerably faster with some v-force weights (54g) in that clutch... This was worth 3 tenths on an asphault track in 330ft.

    Only problem with that is when it comes time to spray the nitrous it will hit the rev limiter. :(

    This is on a built motor haven't tried it on a 08 brute.

    What tires are you guys running?

     
    I'm running 27" MST's.
     
    Should I change all weights to 54g or just two of them?
     
    Also - how much do the stock weights weight?

    -----------------------------
    Fredonia Freeks ATV
    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
    04 Foreman 450 with a few...  

    WAR EAGLE!!!!!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/AUCatRider
    #23
    BAD BRUTE 650
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/20 07:54:33 (permalink)
    Stock weights are 58 Grams and yes try 2 V Force Weights and 2 Brute Weights,thats what I am running but I am Drag racing with this setup,but you never know all bikes act different so give it a shot.
    #24
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/20 08:37:02 (permalink)
    thanks for all the help guys!!! I'm going to try some different stuff with the weights and let you all know. Plus i'm going on a big ride this weekend so maybe it'll have time to "wear" in some and see some difference.
    I'll keep everyone posted on the progress. If you have any more suggestions - please feel free to continue posting!
     
    I really appreciate it!

    -----------------------------
    Fredonia Freeks ATV
    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
    04 Foreman 450 with a few...  

    WAR EAGLE!!!!!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/AUCatRider
    #25
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Update - Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/23 08:20:55 (permalink)
    Alright - i was able to put 30/35 miles on the new clutch work this weekend. I dont think the rpms are what they should be so I'm going to lighten a couple of the weights.
    John got back to me and said the same thing - Doesnt sound like the rpms are where they should be so drop two weights down to 56 grams. - After riding it I do feel thats the case as well.
    After I do this - I'll let everyone know what the outcome is.
     
    Also - I did find my stock primary spring... It was in the bottom of the box under the foam which almost got thrown away. I doubled checked one more time and there it was. So i did get it back.
     
    Guys again - dont get me wrong. I'm not knocking John's work at all. I just think I've got a different scenerio than the others that have not had to change anything else out when they got theirs back. WE ALL KNOW - no bike is the same. In my case - i'm just having to fine tune my setup.
     
    Anybody got any 56 and 54 gram weights they want to get rid of??? [sm=1022.gif]

    -----------------------------
    Fredonia Freeks ATV
    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
    04 Foreman 450 with a few...  

    WAR EAGLE!!!!!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/AUCatRider
    #26
    AUgrizzrider
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    RE: Update - Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/27 13:42:47 (permalink)
    Update:
    Ok - ordered 2 56g epi wts and put them in thursday - now i've got a stock 07 brute with 28" swamplites running with me... [:@] And the other brute i referred to in previous post is passing me at about 30 mph but when I eventually hit top end speed I can gain on him but mid range is not pulling like it did before i had the clutch work done. It pulls off the line real hard then flattens out about 30mph - 50mph then slowly picks up more speed.
    Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

    -----------------------------
    Fredonia Freeks ATV
    -----------------------------

    -08 Brute-650 with a few...
    04 Foreman 450 with a few...  

    WAR EAGLE!!!!!!

    http://community.webshots.com/user/AUCatRider
    #27
    coot23
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    RE: Update - Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/27 15:28:00 (permalink)
    just build it like BRUTIKUS and lets get it!
    29.5s
     

    FREDONIA FREEKS ATV
    Lets Get It!

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    #28
    AV8R
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    RE: Update - Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/28 00:22:22 (permalink)
    That sucks you spent all that money without huge reward. All I've heard is that it's a great mod, but you have me backing away. I don't want to risk not getting results... Maybe he screwed up on yours?
    #29
    BAD BRUTE 650
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    RE: Update - Puzzled after VFJ stage 3 clutch work 2008/06/28 05:35:12 (permalink)
    I think something else is wrong,what Secondary Spring are you running in it right now,what Primary are you running,also you cant run 2 EPI 56 Gram Weights with any of the stock weights IT WILL KILL THE CLUTCH MAN,the angles are different on the EPI weights,and it isnt touching the other weights until a cetain RPM,if you run a different brand weight you need to run them for all four of them but you can run 2 different size weights but the same brand,look at the angles on the weights,put 2 V Force Weights and 2 Brute Weights and a O/B Primary and a Blue Secondary in it,get Springs from Dalton if you cant get them PM and I will get them for you we are a Dalton Dealer and they are one of my Sponsors also,let me know if I can help.
    #30
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